5 GT Turbo F Variant Engine Conversions

[Mark Davis]

As per title. Is there a thread explaining all the various options ? With work required and costs? Can't find anything via search.

If not who can point out what's required ? Best variants ? Parts required ?

I've discussed this in the past on various Facebook sites but hard to find the information months on.

I'd like to know about engine mounting, best block/head combo ? gearbox, manifolds etc.

TIA

 

[Adey]

i dont think anyone has passed his 808bhp f series engine build so id say he would be the go too guy

 

[Mark Davis]

Just emailed Scoff.

Who are the members who have done similar conversions that are on TR? Isn't James Sargeant one?

 

[DaveL485]

there are lots of f series though, i think the 1.7 volvo engine is possibly an F?

• F1N/F2N/F3N: 1721 cc
• F7P: 1764 cc (injection R19 16V 138HP)
• F3P: 1794 cc
• F4P: 1783 cc (evolution of the F3P, 16V with variable valve control on the inlet camshaft)
• F3R/F4R/F7R: 1998 cc
• F5R: 1998cc (direct fuel injection - IDE - only 2 years in production, used in the Megane Coupé and the Laguna II)
• F8Q/F9Q: 1870 cc (indirect injection/direct injection/commonrail)

And more detail
F4x

The F4x is an indirect actuated 16-valve DOHC with a multipoint-EFI system

• F4P 1.8 L (1,783 cc or 109 in3), B x S: 82.7 by 83.0 millimetres(3.26 in × 3.27 in).
  • 1998–2001 Renault Laguna I
  • 2001–2005 Renault Laguna II
  • 2002 Proton Waja 1.8L
• F4R 2.0 L (1,998 cc or 122 in3), B x S: 82.7 by 93.0 millimetres(3.26 in × 3.66 in).
  • 1993–2000 Renault Laguna I
  • 2003– Renault Mégane
  • 2003– Renault Scenic
  • 1996–2014 Renault Espace
  • 2000– Renault Clio Renault Sport (172, 182, 197 and 200)
  • 2000– Renault Trafic (120)
  • 2000– Formula Renault 2.0
  • 2010– Dacia Duster
  • 2013– Praga R1
  • 2015– Sandero R.S. 2.0
  • 2017– Renault Captur (Brazil)
• F4Rt 2.0 L (1,998 cc or 122 in3), B x S: 82.7 by 93.0 millimetres (3.26 in × 3.66 in).
  • 2002–2003 Renault Avantime
  • 2002–2009 Renault Vel Satis
  • 2002–2014 Renault Espace
  • 2002– Renault Megane III TCe 180,[4] Renault Laguna II+III, Renault Scenic - Twin-scroll turbo by Mitsubishiwith 165-180 hp (with overboost 190 hp on TCe 180) [5]
  • 2003– Renault Megane II Sport 225/230 hp, 2005– Renault Laguna II/III GT 205 hp,
  • 2009– Renault Megane III Sport 250/265/275

The F7x was the first of the F-type engine family with a 16-valve DOHC configuration, the valves were directly actuated by Hydraulic tappets. both the 1.8l as the 2.0l were equipped with a multipoint-EFI system.
Applications:

• F7P 1.8 L (1,764 cc or 108 in3), B x S: 82.0 by 83.5 millimetres (3.23 in × 3.29 in).
  • 1988–1997 Renault R19
  • 1991–1996 Renault Clio
• F7R 2.0 L (1,998 cc or 122 in3), B x S: 82.7 by 93.0 millimetres (3.26 in × 3.66 in).
  • 1993–1996 Renault Clio Williams
  • 1996–1999 Renault Megane
  • 1995–1999 Renault Sport Spider
  • 1999– Moskvitch 214242 “Ivan Kalita” (Russia only)

 

[DaveL485]

From what I can gather:

The F4RT would be the best base for an F4R turbo engine but it only fits the 6-speed box and that wont go in a 5 without chassis mods and driveshaft work.

The F4R NA fits the 5 speed JC box and that will go in a 5 without chassis mods and thats why people turbo the NA lump instead of using the F4RT.

The F7 is also made for the 5 speed box, the P being the 1.8 version and the R being the 2.0 version from the Sport Spider and Williams Clio.


I would still go for the F4RT, suck it up with the chassis mods and enjoy the six speed box with factory diff. WORTH IT. Pick up a Meg 250 setup and you can map it to mid 300's power and torque straight off, as far as I know. Short term pain, long term gain.

 

[Mark Davis]

As it currently stands I can pick up F7p block, sump, head, R19 inlet manifold plus crank & crank pulleys from that Chris lad from Scotland for £180. He has checked it over and sent me pic, will need a skim and a hone but no cracks evident.

I could then over a period of 6-9 months slowly build this up with Wossner pistons, pec rods - £950 approx. Some head work (valves, springs, porting etc) £500 approx. Some decent cams with verniers, £350-500 approx. New oil pump, bearings, polish/re-grind crank, probably another £250. Ask Matt Rowley to make me an exhaust manifold - probably another £500. Scoff to sort new loom and use my ECU - £150. Source a gearbox although couldnt I use my JB3 box that I have just had refurbished?

So all in all for a very good strong rebuilt block i'd be looking at about £2k - £2.5k including manifolds & loom.

I wouldnt need to fuck with shafts or making engine fit other than asking Matt to make me one engine mount.

Anything I am not considering ?

The compare this to the F4Rt idea ? No idea on prices for engine, gearbox, chassis modifications ?

 

[Brigsy]

Chassis rail on a gtt needs loads of chopping to fit the ndo gearbox - seen one done. Also the ndo with lsd is a small fortune if you can find one as they are very sought after.

Would swerve that option myself and go for the vag gearbox - the chassis rail still needs chopping for that though. Loads of work for either gearbox...

 

[Mark Davis]

So many options and considerations.

Going to think on the idea for a while, no real rush to be honest just thinking long term. Still plenty of fun to be had from the old C1J.

 

[Mark Davis]

Here is Chris's take.

 

[andybond]

F4RT

No - thats incorrect.

f4r 774 to be accurate. The f4RT was an acroymn made up.

 

[andybond]

View attachment 21353 Here is Chris's take.

f7p is cheaper to extract power.
It also mates nicely to the o2m box which you will need.

The Meg lump - 774 will need pistons , rods , bearings , cam , valves to reach 400+ , much more an budget a manifold.

The 250 engine - 874 will do 360ibft on a 20t turbo with nothing else.

 

[Andyquadra]

F4RT

LOL just read that as fart!

 

[Andyquadra]

What do the likes of Scoff and Robbie use ?

for some reason I seam to remember
172 bottom end with a volvo crank to make it low comp/1.8L and a sodding great big turbo!

 

[Adey]

for some reason I seam to remember
172 bottom end with a volvo crank to make it low comp/1.8L and a sodding great big turbo!

think that was an early scoff engine build

 

[Andyquadra]

there are lots of f series though, i think the 1.7 volvo engine is possibly an F?

think thats the crank Scoff used in the 172 bottom end

 

[DaveL485]

I'm still with the 250 engine and box, take the hit on installing it (get DJM to do it or someone like that) and reap the benefits going forward.

If I didn't do that then it'd be a 197 lump with VVT removed and a turbo stuck on with a JC5 box.

I wouldn't even contemplate the older F7. But then i'm not you

 

[Mark Davis]

If and when I do it I will take the F4 route. Looks as if I can pick up a full engine for £200-£300 as a starting point.

In the meantime I'm going to concentrate on the C1J. I'll look at the conversion again next year. At least now I know a lot more thanks to you fine folk.

 

[andybond]

If and when I do it I will take the F4 route. Looks as if I can pick up a full engine for £200-£300 as a starting point.

In the meantime I'm going to concentrate on the C1J. I'll look at the conversion again next year. At least now I know a lot more thanks to you fine folk.

I would consider what power and box you are going to be mating it to before finalising your choice

 

[GREENER]

Hi all, has anyone got any information on what's involved in fitting the megan with it's six speed box in the renault 5, or pictures on the chassis leg that needs modification. Thanks.

 

[Mark Davis]

Hi all, has anyone got any information on what's involved in fitting the megan with it's six speed box in the renault 5, or pictures on the chassis leg that needs modification. Thanks.

I think Matt Cole on RTOC forum as done this but don’t think he is on here.

 

[GREENER]

I think Matt Cole on RTOC forum as done this but don’t think he is on here.

I have seen pictures, but none of information of what has been modified, so was more looking for pictures/information of what modifications has been done/needed to the chassis leg for the gearbox.