Clio My 197/Meglio conversion

[DaveL485]

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One of these might be OK for those sorts of figures?

Thats cheap for new! Will add to my watch list in case the used one falls through thanks!

 

[Brigsy]

I have a used megane milltek cat back section of exhaust with flexi that a lot of the meglio conversions use , 2.75” bore if you need one.

 

[DaveL485]

Thurs & Fri booked off work, weekend also free for garage stuff....so....I think we are going for it.

 

[Mark_L]

The most awkward thing for me was that I didn't remove the Meg engine so had to work everything out.

 

[DaveL485]

The most awkward thing for me was that I didn't remove the Meg engine so had to work everything out.

I didnt either, ive been going over the pile of parts and asking questions, labelling, trying to iron out anything that might trip me up. I think I have question marks over two wires which I can likely resolve when the 197 loom comes off, and then the cooling system setup riddle but that'll be an adhoc make-it-at-the-time job. I'll use the Meg rad/condenser so I wont have to adapt to the Clio stuff, I can mount the Meg rad easy enough. I want it rattled out as quick as poss because the V6 will have to live outside while I do it, which i'm not too pleased about but been let down by the geezer/place where I was supposed to be working on it and i'm too impatient to wait.

 

[Mark_L]

I fitted the clio rad, I believe the Meg rad isn't a straight forward fit. You need to modify the top panel? But it's easier for the cooler hose on the lh side between the leg and the rad, I modified my cooler to go around the leg.

I've got an alloy meg rad to go in this time.

 

[DaveL485]

I fitted the clio rad, I believe the Meg rad isn't a straight forward fit. You need to modify the top panel? But it's easier for the cooler hose on the lh side between the leg and the rad, I modified my cooler to go around the leg.

I've got an alloy meg rad to go in this time.

My theory is that the package going in from the Meg, complete, works as a package. I intend on fitting that package - loom, Rad, AC condenser, Intercooler blah blah to the car...making the card work around the turbo package as far as I can.

 

[Will D93]

how’s it going?

 

[DaveL485]

how’s it going?

Had it fire up about 8.30 PM this evening, no cooling system or exhaust though. Will write up a proper post Monday

 

[Turbell]

I like the idea of these, there's a Cup on Trader with a crunchy box for 2.5K, but it's not rotten so it'd be a departure from the norm for me.

 

[DaveL485]

So after 6 hours Thursday. 2 Friday (plus six hours driving and unloading my new toy - see garage thread), and 8 yesterday i'm aching and tired. Going back outside in a sec, see where we get to before I quit and watch the F1!

 

[DaveL485]

TLR - Worked my ass off and fitted the meg lump, it's running but not finished. You can skip to the next post now

So, here is a rough account of my Thursday>Sunday in the garage.

Stage one is pretty much straight forward. You gotta strip out the Clio kit. I dropped the front end off, then drained the rad and popped it off before putting it in the garage.






225 engine mulling over it's final destination



Took the front rad support structure off, wheels etc, stripped the ECU out and disconnected the UPC...pretty standard stripdown stuff.



Drained the fluids



This is all standard stuff really, pulling the full engine and box complete with engine loom and coolant pipes.





PS, 75,100 mile excellent condition 197 engine for sale!

I made a hole



I then dropped the exhaust shield off the underneath of the tunnel, took the centre console out inside and razzed out the four 13mm

bolts holding the shifter assembly in, it comes out the bottom complete with cables. The Meg one is a straight swap, you do need to switch it out as the cable ends are different and the gearknob shift pattern is different (reverse lives right-down not up-left)





If you're doing this tie these up to the bulkhead before refitting the engine.



To end the six hour stint on day one I fitted the decat downpipe to the meg engine. The inner of the three studs to the turbo flange is a swine to access to tighten properly with the 13mm nut (M8x1.25), but if you use a 197 manifold nut (also M8x1.25 but deeper with 10mm hex) it makes it loads easier with the smaller spanner, and you can get the ring on it.



...and then swapped the top cambelt cover over from the 197 engine which you need to match the cars suspended engine mount & anti-rotation stabiliser positions.

 

[Turbell]

Really like the idea of these, watching with interest, bet it makes a quick little monkey.

 

[DaveL485]

Friday I only had a couple of hours before I had to leg it out and do stuff, so I popped out to the garage and basically just wrestled the engine into place and bolted up the mounts. It goes in the same way it came out






it's real tight at the back there, so make sure you bolt up the downpipe before you fit the lump. Also, I forgot the extra heatshielding on the bulkhead and had to struggle to get it in after the fact - make sure you do that with an empty bay and remember to cover the fuel line on the chassis rail.

Saturday I had a full day so after a lie in and breakfast got back on it from about 11.30 to 7.30. It's just a matter of figuring out how to make things work, like the battery positive terminal (Megane top, Clio Bottom)



Once you take all the crap away you can trim down the Meg large terminal and attach it to the Clio one, needed to release some wire length from the loom to get it to the battery so just cut away the wrapping, pulled it out then rewrapped it back up.



Matrix pipes line up nicely on the bulkhead but one is slightly larger and the spring clip wont clamp it hard enough, so swapped that for a jubilee.



This bit of the AC system fouled the downpipe, in fact the whole AC think is a pain in the ass and I see now why people sack it off. I persuaded this pipe out of the way with a large crowbar



Plumbed in the brake servo line - note that with a turbo car that pressurises the manifold you MUST retain the one way valve from the Meg engine. Also note in this pic I had it the wrong way around, the fat side goes toward the servo, the thin side goes toward the manifold. I heated the black plastic pipe to remove and refit the end connectors.



Connected this power lead to the clio fuse holder in front of the battery



I also pulled apart this orange fuse holder from the Meg loom



And replaced it with this green one off the Clio loom, it all fitted in nicely until I came to do the wiring and realised it was now redundant - the other end goes to one of the UPC connectors of the Megane loom and it's not retained in the Clio connector



This is where I decided to reassemble driveshafts and swivel hubs, you have to use the Megane shafts as the 'box splines are bigger but they bolt straight in with no issues (*NOTE* i'm using a phase 2 Megane 225 rig). I lost a shedload of time here because one of the drop links threaded when I rattle gunned it on and I had to get a new one, then one of the bloody track rod ends ate its own threads too and resulted in the nut getting stuck half on, half off. When I eventually got the nut off I binned it, and recut the thread on the track rod, fitted a new nut. You just dont need shit like that going on when you have a long day/big project on the go!

Now we move along to the engine loom interface to the car which i'll put in a new post...

 

[DaveL485]

So, wiring. Aside from the battery positive and negative terminals which are straight forward enough there is the UPC interface to deal with. This consists of three connectors to the Clio UPC. The Megane loom also has 3 connectors, similarly grouped. One plug is identical in fitting but not configuration and two plugs are different in fitting and configuration. I labelled up the Megane loom wires with pen & tape before I pulled the plugs apart.

This is the Clio plug setup



This is the Megane plug setup



The bigger white plug is the matching one. You can release the back section of this plug and the connectors fall out so you can just re-insert them in the new config.

Credit for the paper drawings to a chap called Andrew Shand, which I have then made a few scribbles on for wiring colours and stuff like that. Note that this diagram looks at the connector from the BACK



Same drawing, different scribble



This is the Megane plug in the Clio UPC in it's reconfigured state (ie finished)



The next connector I did was the six pin one with the fan wiring and starter kick. These wires were hefty and my soldering iron (despite being one of the pimp dremel ones) wasn't man enough to solder up the joins so I had to use crimps for now. Please forgive me I will improve this lol. Note that this diagram is from a FACING view, ie, looking into the pluggy end of the connector (I was scratching my head a bit on the diagram until Mike S saved the day with that suggestion)





Pin 4 of the Meg plug was the positive cable that I mentioned in yesterdays post that wasn't used.

Important note here, when I wired it in, I noticed that the starter kick on the Clio loom was white and Renault have always, ALWAYS used white for the starter kick on every loom ive worked on. On the Megane loom i'd labelled the grey as the starter kick and white as the fan - so I assumed i'd got it wrong and flipped it. This was an error and the white starter kick on the UPC side goes to the grey wire in the meg loom (I didnt get a pic after I swapped it)



Third connector is back to viewing from the BACK of the plug







So far, everything seems to be working OK! This was where I finished on Saturday, so to get me from a working 197 to a minimum-running 225 lump (no exhaust, no coolant, bare minimum) was 6 + 2 + 8 hours = 16 hours approx. Considering i'm on my own and i've never gone any deeper on a 197 that an aux belt and coil spring/driveshaft change, and i've never worked on a 225 at all I thought that was OK

 

[Duncan Grier]

Not bad for a Cov pikey......not bad at all sir

 

[DaveL485]

And so we come to Sunday, I had planned on going to Swansea in the morning but that got delayed so I ended up with another decent slot in the garage, 11-4.30 which gave me enough time to then watch the F1 before going over to her place for my dinner

I cut the sealing ring off the Clio loom and put it on the meg loom now in the car, because trust me, you DO NOT want water in your UPC module. I squashed a bit of sealant in to the cut line too.







Then I sat the Meg rad on the lower crossmember. It located in a ready made hole on the passenger side



so I just marked the peg on the drivers side and used a step drill to bore out a locating hole, and squirted some underseal at it.












Now, if I had known at this point how high the rad sits I would have dropped the crossmember off and modded it so the rad sits lower, like this.



After i'd already committed to chopping out the top crossmember (which is plastic) and realising just how much you have to cut away to make it line up I wished I hadn't.... you need to cut up all the way past the horn bracket.

 

[DaveL485]

Oh, I forgot to mention above, first Sunday job was the clutch system. It's hydraulic, and the meg pipework on the gearbox plugs straight into the Clio line from the body, at the bulkhead. I'd connected it the day before, and bunged some fluid in to let it drain down in to the concentric slave. there is no through-bleed on this system (SHIT IDEA). The bleed point is at the joint to the slave as it enters the 'box. Soooo...how do you get the air out of the slave?!. As I said, shit idea. You have to assume that given time gravity will allow the fluid to drain down into the slave, leaving the air higher up, hopefully behind the bleed point. If i'd had a syringe handy i'd have filled the slave like that before connecting the pipe. Anyway, I filled the brake master with fluid, stuck 10psi behind it and unclipped the line to the slave - you dont even get a screwy bleed nipple you have to half release the clutch line itself (SHIT IDEA ALSO). I ran the fluid through till the new stuff was bleeding out, then clipped the line back in. Amazingly, when I tried the pedal, it was bang on first time.

I took the pipes off the Meg header tank and sized up the Dacia Sandero one I was advised to use, the pipes fit OK....However, do NOT mount it like this as the bloody bonnet wont shut!!!





So I cut off the back left mounting lug, trimmed the front mounting lug and then modified the rear right mounting lug to hold a spire clip. I fed an M6 through from the back of the turret into the spire clip, so the header tank is now bolted to the suspension turret, sat further back and lower than the first attempt. At least the bonnet shuts now.



I'd also lobbed the boost hoses on so I could connect the two sensors in the pipe leading to the plenum, then I filled the coolant up and bled from the stat housing and matrix pipe, then fired it up to see if 1)it held water and 2)it ran without chucking any errors on the dash. I ran it to about 1/4 on the gauge and there didnt seem to be any (large) leaks and no errors on the dash

I'd spent a lot of the time trying to trim as little of the slam panel as possible, so this is as far as I got other than putting the wheels back on so I could check it moved under its own steam. It did, so it got hoofed out the garage so the Vee could go back in its spot as I didnt want to leave it outside through the week.



I'm still debating on whether to drop the rad and fit a new, unmolested top slam panel, or whether to go for a 197 alloy rad, or what.

Still to do -
Exhaust
Reassemble scuttle and wipers
Reassemble front end/headlights
Decide on what to do about the rad/slam panel
Sort an air filter, I was gonna use the 21's old one but it's way too big to get in the space! I've order a filthy cheap eBay cone filter for the interim.
Pick up the Megane 18's I accidentally bought for it
Figure out the AC system, and see if it's keep-able. The Clio AC rad has the condenser thing attached to it, the meg one doesnt and the Clio pipework doesnt match with the Meg AC rad. I think if it's retained i'll have to make the Clio AC rad fit on the meg radiator. We'll see. The AC didnt work anyway (though i would like to fix and retain it).
All the gears engage and work but it's really hard to get reverse, I have to give it a proper wrench right and down, so I need to look at that, what needs adjusting or whatever.

Budget wise to date, I have spent:
£1000 on the conversion package
£90 on the decat downpipe
£15 on the header tank
£80 in fuel viewing and collecting the conversion package
£30-£40 on engine oil, box oil, oil filter. Coolant and brake fluid I had 'in stock'
I bought a Meglio shifter and Meglio engine loom separate but didnt use either in the end so not counting those
£15 eBay cone filter
£70 on having my 197 immobiliser data copied to the Meg ECU, at EFI parts but I didnt pay for that my mate did after I lent him the 197 for a couple of weeks last month.

Running total - £1240

 

[andybond]

I am not sure on the age of the meg rad you have. Mine weeped on the nearside after a while. Do NOT buy one from ECP/GSF. Buy genuine ones only. They aftermarket ones are shite.

 

[DaveL485]

I am not sure on the age of the meg rad you have. Mine weeped on the nearside after a while. Do NOT buy one from ECP/GSF. Buy genuine ones only. They aftermarket ones are shite.

No idea. Looks in reasonable nick. I'll use it for now unless it leaks