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Phase II steering lock increase

Steve-V6-D61

New Member
There’s been to odd post about increasing the steering lock on Phase II car and after driving mine to the MOT station I was amazed by how little lock is available, so I dug out Harry post on what’s need to done.

Don't know if anybody is aware of this, but the Clio V6 has, as Clarkson mentioned a bigger turning circle than an oil tanker.

Well, I've got good news for the RS2 (phase2) drivers.

The RS2 has a wider track on the front, but still the same steering rack of the RS1. This steering rack has also been taken from another standard production car, which one I don't remember.
On the RS1 they needed to limit the steering angle, and did this with two plastic shims.

On the RS2 you can safely take of 4.5 mm of these plastic shims.
This dramatically increases your steering angle, hence more important the drift angle beyond which you are just a passenger in your car.


You might have trouble removing the fastener below the ABS unit, but you can use a pipe which fits over, drill a hole into it, weld a nut on it, and next clamp it with a short bolt. With this you can loosen it from the outside through the wheel arch.

Enjoy the mechanics, it's more than worth the trouble


So today,it was out with the spanners, its VERY easy to do in fact you can do it from inside the front of the car, but its easier fit you take off the wheels as well. You dont need to remove the track rod ends from the hubs.

So after jacking up the car and removing the wheels, cut the tie wraps off the steering gaiters and pull back up the steering rods to expose the inner ball joint. At this point you will see the spacers, on my car offside one was purple and the other black, you need to find a large 32 mm spanner but it must be narrow due the shape of the inner ball joint, I made mine from a old spanner I had, I ground off both sides until it was thin enough to fit over the inner ball joint.

IMG_0816.jpg


The spanner size is 32mm so you will need to source one beforehand or PM and I can lend you mine, you pay the postage both ways, mind !

You can get at both ends OK although it’s a bit fiddly next to the ABS pump.

Didn’t need to make the tool Harry spoke about, the spanner was fine.

Removing the inner ball joint can be a bit stiff due to nut lock on the threads, once off the spacer comes off as well, its 10mm thick, I reduced mine by the 4.5mm recommended by Harry, just used and angle grinder and finished them off with some wet and dry.
IMG_0814.jpg


Then just reinstall them putting some thread lock on the inner balls joint before screwing them in. The worst job is getting the boot rubbers back over the rack, the drivers side was a b***tard, it took 20 minutes to do it. Due to the power steering pipes getting in the way.

IMG_0815.jpg


I would say it took 1.5 hours to do the whole job, it would have been less had it not been for the boot.

Was it worth it well I’ll measure the turning circle and let you know, but anything more is an improvement on the standard lock which is pitiful.


Enjoy the mechanics, it's more than worth the trouble, lets hope so.

Steve
 
Nice thread! :approve:
Very curious how it will work out. I know Harry's car very well and a lot was improved after he sold it
 
Had the car up on ramps to check the clearance around the wheel arches and there still plenty of space before touching in the arch liners, but need to allow for dive under braking so will leave it as is for now.

The steering lock is much better, not like a normal car but MUCH better, I will do a turning circle and measure it when i get a chance.

I may even take a bit more off but dont want too mad and end up touching the arch liners, maybe we could do a test at Gaydon in April against a standard car.

Steve
 
Excellent - I have a week off work very soon and before I re-assemble the front end I'll be doing this.

[smilie=thanks.gif] [smilie=thanks.gif]
 
I like the idea of finally being able to drift the vee properly! Serioulsy good work Steve. The amount of information you have provided over the course of your rebuild is so so valuable to the forum. Top man! :bow:
 
Jim Green":1iv7agcc said:
Excellent - I have a week off work very soon and before I re-assemble the front end I'll be doing this.

[smilie=thanks.gif] [smilie=thanks.gif]
jim, when you do this could you measure and let me know the spacer dia and hole size, also thickness and i will try to get some pre made to save the time whilst its in bits.
 
i think there was some comments about this before and the reasons reno may have done this possible pendalum affect under braking etc road test under hard driving etc before every one does it and ends up backwards in a ditch caution first i think :race:
 
Hi Ray

I understand your comments, but i disagree with you, on two levels.

One, I dont care about crashing when I have do a 8 point turn to get in a parking space in front of sniggering bystanders.

Two, The metro 6R4, RS2000, MR2, 911, alpines, etc dont have a cr*p turning circle, the ability to catch it on the first loss of traction out weighs the chance of having a, what we bikers call a tank slapper.

But each to his own, Harry said the turning circle was the same on the Phase 2 because it had the same rack as a Phase 1 even though the arches were bigger on the Phase 2.

Cheers

Steve
 
Having exsperianced many a tank slapper and a couple of offs I don't appreiciate your condisending remarks and I find it very irresponsible to praise these early findings due to possible safety issues it may be wise to find the haddleing limitations before praising the vertues of a radical mod reno will have spent time and money on this problem otherwise the issue would have been resolved i am all for a better turnig circle but this might be a trade off ,I advice caution
 
Touchy or what !!!!

Sorry i spoke SIR

I put all posts on here due to the good atmosphere that seem to exsit on this for forum and i hope people find them intresting and helpful,

I find your comment about my post insulting and completly ilogical.

I am not forcing anyone to do this mod, it was origially posted by Harry who by all accounts had very close links with Renault.

I don't appreiciate your condisending remarks
you should meet me on a good day :rofl:
 
im not touch mate ,just concerned you may get a little giddy before we get the whole pictures most vees are written off due to the arse coming around ,and when playing with peoples lives i would be very careful. the rally boys have plenty of knowledge on this .having more confidence to throw it into a corner thinking they have more chance to correct a(TANK SLAPPER) might just be the end of another vee or even worse, just looking out for you and others however if you still feel like doing it crack on but test it out on some airfeild fist
 
Sorry guys I mentioned drifting in relation to drift days on track not on public roads (except Sammy Turbo! ;) ) Steve is posting up for easier parking and three point turns. I doubt anyone is considering the mod to drive recklessly on public roads. The mod just means you have more of a chance of catching the back end when it steps out unexpectedly which happened to me once on a patch of oil on the road and I just about caught the rear before I hit an island. It would have been nice to have had the extra lock. The shocking thing was how quickly it all happened and I was driving normally. As the guys on some of the meets will testify I am always at the back of the pack! Quite right to raise the issue of safety but safety concerns are valid if you drive dangerously but for normal driving and braking I dont think its a major issue and can only be a benefit.
Steve if you want I can test it on track for you ;)
 
dont forget to inform the insurance dont what to put it in a ditch to find the wont pay because you altered steering and god forbid you kill some one just a thought
 
Nas

The spacers have a 45 degree angle on one of the internal edges, still machinable but you will need a good drawing of the actual part.

Cheers

Steve
 
Hi Tim

I get what you say, but the increase in lock will only be used for (A) parking (B) if I really c0ck up a corner where the extra lock may save me.

The castor and camber will not change on the original available lock, so the car will not drive any different, all your getting is more lock, if you need it at speed you are in real trouble anyway, but if you loose the back end and run out of lock, your going to be a passenger anyway, so more is better. :)

If your driving the car from lock to lock you deserve to crash, yes you can get a fish tail (on any car) but that's about car control not the down to the amount of lock available unless you run out of lock ! :race:

When i rallied my old TR7V8, I fitted a SDI quick power rack and the lock on that was amazing that was with 10 inch wide slicks in the arches, better than a london taxi and on my 6R4 i fitted a Astra quick rack with electric power assistance so i am not doing this as a ill informed idot. :rollseyes:

So what i am saying is, I see no danger increasing the lock only positives, but you need to make your own desision about this mod.

I've done it and its a big improvment as far as I am concerned and makes the car much more driver friendly.

But any mod needs to be carefully considered and done properly, so it you dont want it dont do it, but its got to be the cheapest major mod you can do thou, its free :rofl:

I think you will find on the Dragon rally car they also moved the rack so relocating the strut mounts would be required, but also on a competition car self centering steering is not important, so you can change the castor angle for more grip on lock, which would be totally unstuitable for road use.
 
timv6":1u766blt said:
V6 2HOT":1u766blt said:
Sorry guys I mentioned drifting in relation to drift days on track not on public roads (except Sammy Turbo! ;) ) Steve is posting up for easier parking and three point turns. I doubt anyone is considering the mod to drive recklessly on public roads. The mod just means you have more of a chance of catching the back end when it steps out unexpectedly which happened to me once on a patch of oil on the road and I just about caught the rear before I hit an island. It would have been nice to have had the extra lock. The shocking thing was how quickly it all happened and I was driving normally. As the guys on some of the meets will testify I am always at the back of the pack! Quite right to raise the issue of safety but safety concerns are valid if you drive dangerously but for normal driving and braking I dont think its a major issue and can only be a benefit.
Steve if you want I can test it on track for you ;)

Nas,

Please clarify "always at the back of the pack??""" [smilie=icon_eek.gif]

I drive slow on public roads and get left way behind the others on meets. I am a hypermiler by nature. Hence I when I hit the oil I was driving normally for the road and the conditions. A serious shock. Extra lock would have been nice.

I will be going sort of near you Steve tomorrow may pop in if your around. Find a car park and compare turning circles!!
 
SPIKE":1f95sief said:
Jim Green":1f95sief said:
Excellent - I have a week off work very soon and before I re-assemble the front end I'll be doing this.

[smilie=thanks.gif] [smilie=thanks.gif]
jim, when you do this could you measure and let me know the spacer dia and hole size, also thickness and i will try to get some pre made to save the time whilst its in bits.


Will Do.......... Will take some pics and do some accurate measurements.
 
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