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CAT c or D -20% max its the law well almost

Steve-V6-D61

New Member
A 'write off' is a colloquial term for a vehicle which has been declared a total loss by an insurer, either following accident damage or theft. There are some 450,000 accident-related write-offs every year and another 150,000 insurance thefts, many of which are subsequently recovered damaged and re-classified. Many write-offs are legitimately allowed back on the roads following a repair; the safest ones to buy are those which have passed an independent vehicle inspection, such as those on HPI's Condition Inspected register. However, almost half of all write-offs are so badly damaged that qualified insurance inspectors determine that they should never go back on the road. To assist the industry and the used car buyer, the Association of British Insurers (ABI) has since 1997 provided the following classification of damage to vehicles that have been deemed an insurance write-off:

o Category A:

Scrap only - this vehicle should be crushed. It should never reappear on the road and there are no economically salvageable parts. It is of value only for scrap metal - e.g. a totally burnt-out vehicle.

o Category B:

The bodyshell should be crushed. The vehicle should never reappear on the road, but it can be broken for spare parts plus any residual scrap metal.

o Category C:

Vehicle extensively damaged and insurer has decided not to repair. May be repaired and put back on the road. Has to pass an inspection costing £36 (2007 price) to be re-registered as damaged repaired.

o Category D:

Vehicle damaged and insurer has decided not to repair. When fixed can be re-registered as damaged repaired.

Think of Cat D like this example:

A Clio V6 is worth £13,000, but sustains some minor cosmetic damage.

The damage will cost £7,500 for an (inflated price) insurance repair that includes the cost of a courtesy car for the owner while the repair takes place.

But the insurer can sell the car off as it is for £6,000.

So the insurer 'writes it off' as a Cat D, saving itself £500, even though the car may be perfectly drivable and suffers only cosmetic damage.

o Category F:

Vehicle damaged by fire and insurer has decided not to repair. When fixed can be re-registered as damaged repaired.

From the The Financial Ombudsman Service
South Quay Plaza
183 Marsh Wall
London E14 9SR


14. vehicles previously "written-off" and then repaired
Most buyers are (rightly or wrongly) put off by the knowledge that a vehicle was previously "written-off", no matter how well it was later repaired – and this can affect its value.

If the policyholder knew the vehicle was a repaired write-off, he/she is likely to have paid less for it. So we are likely to decide that it is not unfair for the insurer to make an appropriate deduction – not more than 20%, unless the insurer can provide good independent evidence for a higher deduction.

But if we are satisfied that the policyholder innocently bought (and insured) the vehicle in complete ignorance of its history, and the repairs were not obviously noticeable, he/she is likely to have paid full price (and a full insurance premium) for it. So we are likely to decide that it would be unfair for the insurer to pay less than the full market value.

So that it Cat D or C are only worth 20% less 20% MAX

Steve
 
on a similar vein:
we all talk about write offs like its something to dread but if the vehicle has been repaired properly what is the problem? another way of looking at it is, if your v6 blew its guts all over the road after a good thrash, and then you repair the engine with a final bill from reno at say 6k is this considered to then be a bad car? (i say 8k as the plenum gaskets are £30 each on their own), its exactly the same as it was broken, now its fixed.
if it were an italian car you would not be happy until someone took te engine to bits and built it properly anyway.
 
Yes good link Steve :approve:

A previous understanding of mine was that even if an insurance company had not written off a car, but had paid out a substantial amount to repair it, then any future claims and subsequent payouts would take this into account ...

And get this ...

I had a run in with an insurance company once over something they called 'betterment' which essentially meant they wanted to know what I had paid for a car and wouldn't insure it for more than that as, in theory, I could make a profit on it being written off !

In this example I was fortunate enough to have paid less than market value for a rare car worth a lot more ...

Martin
 
SPIKE":ozjh802s said:
on a similar vein:
we all talk about write offs like its something to dread but if the vehicle has been repaired properly what is the problem? another way of looking at it is, if your v6 blew its guts all over the road after a good thrash, and then you repair the engine with a final bill from reno at say 6k is this considered to then be a bad car? (i say 8k as the plenum gaskets are £30 each on their own), its exactly the same as it was broken, now its fixed.
if it were an italian car you would not be happy until someone took te engine to bits and built it properly anyway.

Yes, and maybe not quite the same but, you also hear of old classics rotting in a barn or someones garden with barely any salvageable parts and they get restored to original condition (hmmm how is that possible) and they end up being worth shedloads ...

As Vees get older and the owner base appreciates them more and more, potentially as classics, then any stigma associated with repairs will be less relevant. There will always be a hierachy of cars in terms of the best v the worst but this won't necessarily be based IMHO on what kind of repairs a car has had.

Martin
 
Yes, and maybe not quite the same but, you also hear of old classics rotting in a barn or someones garden with barely any salvageable parts and they get restored to original condition (hmmm how is that possible) and they end up being worth shedloads ...

Exactly I have a heritage re shelled Healy, worth more than a restored original, because it's got to be in better condition.
 
My slogan has always been "If it's straight, it's great"

Unfortunately there's so often the case of Taboo = 50% less
 
SPIKE":28u30h0h said:
on a similar vein:
we all talk about write offs like its something to dread but if the vehicle has been repaired properly what is the problem? another way of looking at it is, if your v6 blew its guts all over the road after a good thrash, and then you repair the engine with a final bill from reno at say 6k is this considered to then be a bad car? (i say 8k as the plenum gaskets are £30 each on their own), its exactly the same as it was broken, now its fixed.
if it were an italian car you would not be happy until someone took te engine to bits and built it properly anyway.

the problem is Spike that although there may be some sense in what you say, we still live in the here and now and the fact is that a car with a 'dented' history (no pun intended) would always make me walk away and move on to the next car for sale, and im sure this is the general concensus from most buyers out there! A cat d/c/etc car will ALWAYS take more time and/or hassle to sell on in the future than a straight one!!

Why make a rod for your own back is my take on it!
 
chunkv6":1gp38uc3 said:
SPIKE":1gp38uc3 said:
on a similar vein:
we all talk about write offs like its something to dread but if the vehicle has been repaired properly what is the problem? another way of looking at it is, if your v6 blew its guts all over the road after a good thrash, and then you repair the engine with a final bill from reno at say 6k is this considered to then be a bad car? (i say 8k as the plenum gaskets are £30 each on their own), its exactly the same as it was broken, now its fixed.
if it were an italian car you would not be happy until someone took te engine to bits and built it properly anyway.

the problem is Spike that although there may be some sense in what you say, we still live in the here and now and the fact is that a car with a 'dented' history (no pun intended) would always make me walk away and move on to the next car for sale, and im sure this is the general concensus from most buyers out there! A cat d/c/etc car will ALWAYS take more time and/or hassle to sell on in the future than a straight one!!

Why make a rod for your own back is my take on it!

I agree to some extent, but also consider the cost to buy is typically lower for those people wishing to own a Vee and for those who aren't looking at resales when they initially buy. When there is a wide choice of vehicles and funds available then it is easier to go for what 'may' be considered to be the best cars.

Martin
 
This topic always gets people going, as most of you know I own a Cat D V6 so have a vested interest in talking up CAT values, but I am also a realist.

I don’t mind Cat D too much, I have owned 3 including the V6, but due to my hobby being cars I always brought them in damaged form, dont know if I would like to buy a repaired one though !!!

Corsa 1.2, front end, bumper, wishbone, headlights, front rim and front tyres, etc, mainly damaged chassis rails, light dents due to running over the curbs. CAT D

son then put it in to tree 6 month latter, front bumper, headlights, front subframe, radiator and fan, front bumper rail, slam panel.

Clio 172, subframe, front bumper blade, front bumper, bottom wishbones, 2 alloy wheels, 2 tyres, headlights, spot lights, front grill etc. CAT C

But I also reshelled a MG ZT V8 which was not on the register at all.
As it was a Rover test car that they rolled

dcp_1517-1.jpg

It was stripped to its last nut, bolt and washer

ztfinishedxx.jpg


Which goes to show that you can’t rely on the Vicar register?

The other fact is a new V6 was worth £27000 so could of been damaged to the value of £15000 before being sold off as a CAT C or D car, that a lot of repairs, properly including lots of chassis damage, but if it was to have been repaired by the insurance company it would not show on the register today.

But now with a V6 worth £9000 would be written off for less than £4000 worth of repairs, that’s just a bumper, bonnet and a pair of wings with no chassis damage, so a Cat D at today values would be a better car to own than a car with a insurance repair job to the value of £15,000 done when the car was than a year old.

Does that make sense ?, my Clio v6 was sold for about 40% of full retail value which holds with the formula in my other post? Unfortunally due to the falling prices and the length of time I have spent on my car I would now loose money if I was to sell it.

I would need to sell my Clio V6for aleast £13000 to get my money back.

Steve
 
Steve-V6-D61":p6nvps0u said:
But now with a V6 worth £9000 would be written off for less than £4000 worth of repairs, that’s just a bumper, bonnet and a pair of wings with no chassis damage, so a Cat D at today values would be a better car to own than a car with a insurance repair job to the value of £15,000 done when the car was than a year old.

Does that make sense ?, my Clio v6 was sold for about 40% of full retail value which holds with the formula in my other post? Unfortunally due to the falling prices and the length of time I have spent on my car I would now loose money if I was to sell it.

I would need to sell my Clio V6for aleast £13000 to get my money back.

Steve

Makes perfect sense to me.
I'd have no qualms about buying a properly repaired cat D with receipts or photo's and, in respect of what you rightly mention about values, even a cat C these days but I think it depends who did the post crash assessment and even more importantly who did the subsequent work. I was looking at getting my wife a fiat 500 which needed cosmetic repair, they were all too expensive still but whilst looking I noticed the difference between the damage some assessors considered worthy of a cat D was miles apart, some needed a bumper, bonnet and slam panel with no rad damage or airbags whereas others looked like they'd been chewed up and spat out so there was a big difference between some cars listed with the same category write-off.

MK1's seem to have dropped to a point where there isn't a huge difference in price between the non write off's and the others. That said I think there is a foundation price for Vee's and I believe they will appreciate in time like the mid engined R5 has, so personally I'd hang onto yours rather than chuck the money and effort away by flogging it.
 
Thinking about this again, if a good Mk 2 is worth £15000, mine is 04 with 17100 miles, if its written off at max of minus 20 % for being a Cat D its worth £12000, now where's that tree.

But Ron Hogingson is selling similar for £19000 which makes it worth £15200 !!!!!!!!!!

No not looking to sell but trying to get idea of CAT D values.

Steve
 
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