I have had the 550/650 on Hoffman spec. Prefer now tbh with the grip , just not the roll
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Loltus Exige
- Thread starter andybond
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- car supercharger
Duncan Grier
Well-Known Member
Ahhh yes had Hoffman spec also 
Steve Swan
Well-Known Member
Stiffer springs will work the tyres harder as they tend to push the cornering force on to them, softer springing will compress eating the cornering force, but it has to be released again which takes time. This is why standard cars at circuits usually end up 1 corner behind where they actually are with predictable results!!!
Interesting.
Stock is ~370ib spring, I am at 425ib now. Any suggestions how far up the scale I should go? I foumd 550ib on the road a little too much and I had little feel when the car was going to let go with those.
Somewhere toward the middle?
Steve Swan
Well-Known Member
There's no definite answers. Stiffer better on a dry hot day with sticky tyres. Will be skittish in the wet. Soften it off and it's more forgiving in the wet, but you can't get to it's full potential in the dry. Answer buy 2 cars, set one hard and one soft
I appreciate what you are saying. I back off the ARB now when its wet. I tend to fiddle with the damping too.There's no definite answers. Stiffer better on a dry hot day with sticky tyres. Will be skittish in the wet. Soften it off and it's more forgiving in the wet, but you can't get to it's full potential in the dry. Answer buy 2 cars, set one hard and one soft
I just want to be able to run the car without the roll on a bone dry day. I can adjust for when its raining.
Steve Swan
Well-Known Member
ARB stiffness increases by a 4 th power in diameter, so a little goes a long way, also no rubber, use nylon or ally for bearings and something non flexible at the connections. Backing off the dampers help in the wet, but ultimately it's spring rate that makes the difference.
Steve Swan
Well-Known Member
As an aside, a story.
An old friend Al, had a season in one of the HSSC series (about 20 years ago) They were at Brands and he was in his full FIA 26R on Dunlop Historics, as was everybody else. He was trailing the Lead 26R by about 3 secs a lap in practice and apart from trying everything they could think of, that gap would not close. As they were in the holding paddock waiting for the off, the rain started to spot on the screen. Mike S (my mate and chief mechanic) quickly dropped the tyre pressures and backed off the dampers, as it was all he could do in the time available.
The race started and slowly the drizzle turned to rain. After about 4 fully wet laps the fast 26R which had been losing time furiously, pulled into the pits and retired, Mike S, never a guy to miss an opportunity, sidled up to the driver and engaged him in conversation, It turns out the car was dangerous in the wet, completely undriveable. The reason was that in about 30 mins his team could change all the struts, which was how they went from a dry to wet set up. Al was using more of a `one size fits all set up' which earned him a podium on the day due to the sudden change in the weather, but was much slower in dry conditions.
You pays your money and you takes your chance............
Having an ARB with a good range of adjustment (if that is possible) can be one of the best, one size fits all type modifications and would be the first thing on the list to try. esp. if the car is a bit wayward in the wet now.
I have never been a fan of 50/50 weight distribution . I did try it once by going up 100lbs on rear springs. Problem was I did it on the day it absolutely pissed down at Knockhill and it was entertaining to say the least. Every time you lifted off you were sideways bigtime. On a RWD car I prefer a little more weight on the driven axle. Perhaps if I had changed all 4 springs and softened the car, but kept it at 50/50 it would have been better, so I won't say that's a definitive answer.
It's a case of remembering the principles and trying things.
Stiff springs will force more cornering energy into the tyres, if they are not good enough, or conditions prevent them from having enough grip you will slide and again depending on the tyre it may be progressive or violent.
Soft springs will compress and absorb some of the cornering force, therby taking the load off the tyres, but will cause a delay in the vehicles attitude, which in the dry will give you the one corner behind feeling.
Finally Triple C mag did an article on dampers years ago which stuck with me. The premise was that it was much more important to have your springing correct, than the damping. What they did was they had a nice and very well sorted Manta 400 which was driven round a laid out track to set a base time, this included a slalom test. Then they removed the dampers completely and did it again. It was like a tenth and a half slower virtually no different, the biggest issue was braking points, as the car tended to pitch a little under heavy braking. I have tried this on Liz's car and can confirm that the car felt fine under normalish use on the road.
There must be some funny suspension leverages on the Exige due to the numbers I am seeing on your spring rates, They are big numbers.
What would also be worth trying, is to do the number crunching exercise as on page 64 of The Race and Rally car source book by Allan Staniforth. This will allow you to sanitise some of the figures.
For Example the Dauphine runs 1000 lb front and 400lb rear springs which sounds a bit crazy but the effective rates due to leverage are 400 front and 250 rear which sound a bit more real world and the wheel rates (for damper valving ) are 175 front and 162 rear. I also use this to work out what size spacers I need to make if I want to change springs, but keep the ride heights the same, this allows set up changes to be made at the paddock, in a hurry..............
Happy motoring
An old friend Al, had a season in one of the HSSC series (about 20 years ago) They were at Brands and he was in his full FIA 26R on Dunlop Historics, as was everybody else. He was trailing the Lead 26R by about 3 secs a lap in practice and apart from trying everything they could think of, that gap would not close. As they were in the holding paddock waiting for the off, the rain started to spot on the screen. Mike S (my mate and chief mechanic) quickly dropped the tyre pressures and backed off the dampers, as it was all he could do in the time available.
The race started and slowly the drizzle turned to rain. After about 4 fully wet laps the fast 26R which had been losing time furiously, pulled into the pits and retired, Mike S, never a guy to miss an opportunity, sidled up to the driver and engaged him in conversation, It turns out the car was dangerous in the wet, completely undriveable. The reason was that in about 30 mins his team could change all the struts, which was how they went from a dry to wet set up. Al was using more of a `one size fits all set up' which earned him a podium on the day due to the sudden change in the weather, but was much slower in dry conditions.
You pays your money and you takes your chance............
Having an ARB with a good range of adjustment (if that is possible) can be one of the best, one size fits all type modifications and would be the first thing on the list to try. esp. if the car is a bit wayward in the wet now.
I have never been a fan of 50/50 weight distribution . I did try it once by going up 100lbs on rear springs. Problem was I did it on the day it absolutely pissed down at Knockhill and it was entertaining to say the least. Every time you lifted off you were sideways bigtime. On a RWD car I prefer a little more weight on the driven axle. Perhaps if I had changed all 4 springs and softened the car, but kept it at 50/50 it would have been better, so I won't say that's a definitive answer.
It's a case of remembering the principles and trying things.
Stiff springs will force more cornering energy into the tyres, if they are not good enough, or conditions prevent them from having enough grip you will slide and again depending on the tyre it may be progressive or violent.
Soft springs will compress and absorb some of the cornering force, therby taking the load off the tyres, but will cause a delay in the vehicles attitude, which in the dry will give you the one corner behind feeling.
Finally Triple C mag did an article on dampers years ago which stuck with me. The premise was that it was much more important to have your springing correct, than the damping. What they did was they had a nice and very well sorted Manta 400 which was driven round a laid out track to set a base time, this included a slalom test. Then they removed the dampers completely and did it again. It was like a tenth and a half slower virtually no different, the biggest issue was braking points, as the car tended to pitch a little under heavy braking. I have tried this on Liz's car and can confirm that the car felt fine under normalish use on the road.
There must be some funny suspension leverages on the Exige due to the numbers I am seeing on your spring rates, They are big numbers.
What would also be worth trying, is to do the number crunching exercise as on page 64 of The Race and Rally car source book by Allan Staniforth. This will allow you to sanitise some of the figures.
For Example the Dauphine runs 1000 lb front and 400lb rear springs which sounds a bit crazy but the effective rates due to leverage are 400 front and 250 rear which sound a bit more real world and the wheel rates (for damper valving ) are 175 front and 162 rear. I also use this to work out what size spacers I need to make if I want to change springs, but keep the ride heights the same, this allows set up changes to be made at the paddock, in a hurry..............
Happy motoring
I shall read and digest that!
My current ARB has 5 holes for quick adjustment
The blades have near infinite adjustment ( within reason )
I like slidey slidey on a wet track rather than grip and off into the scenery!
My springs are not nearly as high in the ib as some of the others out there. These are deemed a compromise apparently.
I’ll check out page 64!
My current ARB has 5 holes for quick adjustment
The blades have near infinite adjustment ( within reason )
I like slidey slidey on a wet track rather than grip and off into the scenery!
My springs are not nearly as high in the ib as some of the others out there. These are deemed a compromise apparently.
I’ll check out page 64!
Steve Swan
Well-Known Member
Maybe we should start a book section, but this recent addition to my library is an excellent read.
It's a sort of modern day Fred Phun, how to make your car handle, which is a bit of a Bible for me, but was written in the early seventies covering cars of the sixties, so not relevant to most on here. This book is easier to read, does not get bogged down in Maths. Well worth getting a copy.
It's a sort of modern day Fred Phun, how to make your car handle, which is a bit of a Bible for me, but was written in the early seventies covering cars of the sixties, so not relevant to most on here. This book is easier to read, does not get bogged down in Maths. Well worth getting a copy.
I have found myself with another hour tonight so a few more bits off. Found the hidden 5mm allen bolt , the bolts above the indicator and had some fun with the headlights. Someone has been here before me and either lost bits , or broken bits.
Or did they come from factory like that? hmm...
One labelled sorted list of bolts/nuts/plastic shite
A pair of the finest Hethel super expensive plastic that needs a re coating
No wheel arch naked view.
Spotted that the back of one headlight has a cracked bit of plastic. Not a dealbreaker as it seemed solid
Spotted that the large plastic cowling above the rad below the grilles has a crack on it. Ill try and plastic weld that from the reverse so to hide it.
Fair bit of rust on some of the bolts too. Ill clean up the residue when reassembling the car.
Plan is to send the light covers away for a polish and re-uv coating.
I want to take out hte pro alloy aircon rad as the aircon hasnt worked for years and also have a look at the heater/cooler box as it seems to do what it wants which is typically the opposite of what I want.
Or did they come from factory like that? hmm...
One labelled sorted list of bolts/nuts/plastic shite
A pair of the finest Hethel super expensive plastic that needs a re coating
No wheel arch naked view.
Spotted that the back of one headlight has a cracked bit of plastic. Not a dealbreaker as it seemed solid
Spotted that the large plastic cowling above the rad below the grilles has a crack on it. Ill try and plastic weld that from the reverse so to hide it.
Fair bit of rust on some of the bolts too. Ill clean up the residue when reassembling the car.
Plan is to send the light covers away for a polish and re-uv coating.
I want to take out hte pro alloy aircon rad as the aircon hasnt worked for years and also have a look at the heater/cooler box as it seems to do what it wants which is typically the opposite of what I want.
Duncan Grier
Well-Known Member
I remember the vx220 heater/cooler box and how poor from factory. Refurbished and sealing box and air feed, vent connections def helped but never near a 'normal' cars one.....what is actually wrong with aircon?
I would be repairing and keeping but get some weight saving to be had and one less thing to worry about.
Lights are crazy ££££ now
I would be repairing and keeping but get some weight saving to be had and one less thing to worry about.
Lights are crazy ££££ now
Tonight has been quite productive.
Firstly started to remove the loom from the lights. Lens have gone off for a refurb
I have all sorts of bits missing where there should be bits. See the big ugly rusty hole there? Should have been a bolt in there. There wasnt. Why?
I tried to thread the wire through the grommit. It doesnt work that way. Grommit comes with the wire..
Towing eye off and clam came off!
Pleae with the space I have in my double garage. Worth it just for this job!
Pretty sure that pipe isnt supposed to be there like that
Pipe back on. Does anything from factory hold it on? I can see it wiggling its way off again at some point? Mk1 Tie wrap?
No tie wrap ( yet ) but jobs a good un
My attention then turned to the parts that had been under the sea for the last 150 years and the shite stuck in crevices for the past 148 years.
Not too bad Nitrons. Refitted approx 2 years back after a refurb
Scabby AF. I have given it a minor wire brush and its come up better but TBH needs taking apart and coating/blasting/setting on fire.
I only took the clam off to remove the pro alloy aircon rad. Its in this enclosure and you know what? I dont know if I have the energy now I am here to remove the radiator / aircon / chargecooler rad. Thats a lot of liquids to drain and refil. So I turned to cleaning...
Nitrons took a bit of effort but a mile better
You can actually see the chassis is silver not a stained brown. Opposite side in progress
But wait! What is this? Its like something off time team! with the amount of debris and I dont know what caught behind the mudflap.
Sorted that out!
JCB coming next week to clear this lot up!
Thats it for now. I lost feeling in my left knee ( bad ) and am having a word with myself about removing the aircon rad.
Firstly started to remove the loom from the lights. Lens have gone off for a refurb
I have all sorts of bits missing where there should be bits. See the big ugly rusty hole there? Should have been a bolt in there. There wasnt. Why?
I tried to thread the wire through the grommit. It doesnt work that way. Grommit comes with the wire..
Towing eye off and clam came off!
Pleae with the space I have in my double garage. Worth it just for this job!
Pretty sure that pipe isnt supposed to be there like that
Pipe back on. Does anything from factory hold it on? I can see it wiggling its way off again at some point? Mk1 Tie wrap?
No tie wrap ( yet ) but jobs a good un
My attention then turned to the parts that had been under the sea for the last 150 years and the shite stuck in crevices for the past 148 years.
Not too bad Nitrons. Refitted approx 2 years back after a refurb
Scabby AF. I have given it a minor wire brush and its come up better but TBH needs taking apart and coating/blasting/setting on fire.
I only took the clam off to remove the pro alloy aircon rad. Its in this enclosure and you know what? I dont know if I have the energy now I am here to remove the radiator / aircon / chargecooler rad. Thats a lot of liquids to drain and refil. So I turned to cleaning...
Nitrons took a bit of effort but a mile better
You can actually see the chassis is silver not a stained brown. Opposite side in progress
But wait! What is this? Its like something off time team! with the amount of debris and I dont know what caught behind the mudflap.
Sorted that out!
JCB coming next week to clear this lot up!
Thats it for now. I lost feeling in my left knee ( bad ) and am having a word with myself about removing the aircon rad.
Another free night due to injury. Best make the most of this ..
See those aircon pipes? They were in fairly decent nick TBH. The ones that go from the drier into the blower were loose mind. I guess thats where all my really expensive gas went.
There are two ways of getting the pipes out.
1) The Lotus way
2) The hammer, flathead screwdriver and saw way. I chose method 2 as I wasnt feeling very Lotus-ey tonight.
Be gone pipes!
Now the drier thing had gone from the bulkhead I noted even more shite that had collected. There must be literally tonnes of gravel , soil and odds and sods collected over the years in my car. Ok, might be closer to grams but its annoying all the same. See?
Not there any more! I hobbled off into the house to get my trusty PC cleaner blower thing and blew the debris all over my garage and what appears now to be mostly in my lungs. At least its not in the car crevices any more. See?
Finally a pair of tie wraps to try and keep the pipe on. Its as snug as I can get now.
See those aircon pipes? They were in fairly decent nick TBH. The ones that go from the drier into the blower were loose mind. I guess thats where all my really expensive gas went.
There are two ways of getting the pipes out.
1) The Lotus way
2) The hammer, flathead screwdriver and saw way. I chose method 2 as I wasnt feeling very Lotus-ey tonight.
Be gone pipes!
Now the drier thing had gone from the bulkhead I noted even more shite that had collected. There must be literally tonnes of gravel , soil and odds and sods collected over the years in my car. Ok, might be closer to grams but its annoying all the same. See?
Not there any more! I hobbled off into the house to get my trusty PC cleaner blower thing and blew the debris all over my garage and what appears now to be mostly in my lungs. At least its not in the car crevices any more. See?
Finally a pair of tie wraps to try and keep the pipe on. Its as snug as I can get now.
Duncan Grier
Well-Known Member
Shiney 
