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Chargecooler flow rate

andybond

DataHoover
Staff member
Anyone know much about chargecooler flow rate?

I dont think I am suffering from a low chargecooler flow rate , and in turn I know my IAT are ok as I can monitor this but as ever, if a faster pump offering a higher flow rate going to offer me lower still IAT due to more water hooning round the circuit?

I appreciate there is diminishing returns and to an extent you can pass the water past the chargecooler rad to dissipate the heat too quickly.

Any insights?
 
You running the pro alloy one @andybond? If so go up a bosch pump spec to one supplied with kit, but not Craig Davis big bad boy flow.

Found sealing the gap between cc pre rad and radiator along with making sure rad sealed fully also helped.

Then you are into custom playing about.....similar but different engine in vx220 and found improvement in my custom intake system. Also not sure what your s/c is and if your running that outside it's happy zone compounding issue?
 
Yeah, it’s the PA one @Duncan Grier .

I have the one supplied by PA but ..

I noted the following- ProAlloy have two pumps :

  1. Bosch Part Number 0 392 023 004 Bosch Water Pump - Pro Alloy
Autodoc data tells me the following ( https://www.autodoc.co.uk/bosch/1155414 )

  • Rated Voltage [V]:12
  • Pressure [bar]:0,1
  • Flow rate [l/h]:900 ( 15l/min )
  • Protection Type (IP Code):IP6K7, IP69K
  • Supplementary Article / Supplementary Info:without holder
  • BOSCH:Water Pump, parking heater
  • Item number:0 392 023 004
  1. Bosch Part Number 0 392 022 002 Large Bosch Water Pump - Pro Alloy
Autodoc tells me the following ( https://www.autodoc.co.uk/bosch/1155411 1 )

  • Voltage [V]:12
  • Pressure [bar]:0,3
  • Flow rate [l/h]:1300 ( 21.6l/min )
  • Protection Type (IP Code):IP5K4
  • BOSCH:Water Pump, parking heater
  • Item number:0 392 022 002
  • Our price:138,35 £
  • Manufacturer part number:0 392 022 002
I am pretty sure ours have the Bosch Part Number 0 392 023 004 installed.
 
and if your running that outside it's happy zone compounding issue?
I am waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay outside the efficiency map. The IAT are under control but in the quest for lower as ever. Is the answer as simple as a bigger pump?
 
Address the cause, not the issue 😉

Long time ago now, will have to look at data I have from historic testing, but what's the water temps like v IAT etc? There is science behind it
 
Address the cause, not the issue 😉

Long time ago now, will have to look at data I have from historic testing, but what's the water temps like v IAT etc? There is science behind it

I would love to , however that would mean a TVS1320 charger + strengthened box = £££

Or I could just stick in another pump because ...
 
do you monitor the water temps of the cooling system? moving water too fast wont be efficient, it can actually cool less . Ideally you want a variable speed pump that keeps things at a set temp. If it struggles, increase the rad size and volume of water in the system.
 
Could also be worth running a water wetter, which increases the rate of exchange to the coolant, some experimentation is called for as you may be able to see a drop of up to 4-5 degrees. Not all coolants are the same, as I know form experience. Just speeding up the flow through the system reaches a point where it no longer provides any benefit, if you can increase the rate the coolant absorbs heat and then dumps it , that with increased flow will work better, well until the flowrate is so high you exceed it's reynolds index and becomes turbulent in flow ( like when your cold tap may scream a bit at high flowrates) this lowers the rate of heat transfer in a system . Amazing the absolute nonsense the Gasboard used to teach it's engineers many years ago....
 
Could also be worth running a water wetter, which increases the rate of exchange to the coolant, some experimentation is called for as you may be able to see a drop of up to 4-5 degrees. Not all coolants are the same, as I know form experience. Just speeding up the flow through the system reaches a point where it no longer provides any benefit, if you can increase the rate the coolant absorbs heat and then dumps it , that with increased flow will work better, well until the flowrate is so high you exceed it's reynolds index and becomes turbulent in flow ( like when your cold tap may scream a bit at high flowrates) this lowers the rate of heat transfer in a system . Amazing the absolute nonsense the Gasboard used to teach it's engineers many years ago....
<2000 & >4000 sticks in my head for laminar and turbulent. Can't remember the maths however 😅
 
There is also a kinda Hillbilly idea that you could wet the surface of the coolant to air cooler with a water/ screenwash mix to wet the surface and increase the heat transfer rate to air, sort of Pikey fridge for the Rad, would work well if the Rad was ducted and the residue would not end up all over the engine or tyres....
 
do you monitor the water temps of the cooling system? moving water too fast wont be efficient, it can actually cool less . Ideally you want a variable speed pump that keeps things at a set temp. If it struggles, increase the rad size and volume of water in the system.
No , I haven’t a temp sensor. My thoughts were that IAT will be the deciding factor, the water temps are kind of arbitrary really.

I appreciate what you are saying regarding faster isn’t always better you need some liquid slow enough to absorb the heat.
 
Could also be worth running a water wetter, which increases the rate of exchange to the coolant, some experimentation is called for as you may be able to see a drop of up to 4-5 degrees. Not all coolants are the same, as I know form experience. Just speeding up the flow through the system reaches a point where it no longer provides any benefit, if you can increase the rate the coolant absorbs heat and then dumps it , that with increased flow will work better, well until the flowrate is so high you exceed it's reynolds index and becomes turbulent in flow ( like when your cold tap may scream a bit at high flowrates) this lowers the rate of heat transfer in a system . Amazing the absolute nonsense the Gasboard used to teach its engineers many years ago....
This is what I am trying to figure out - where is the point of no gains.

Useful info , thanks
 
This is what I am trying to figure out - where is the point of no gains.

Useful info , thanks
Unfortunately that point is variable, moved by playing with the various parameters. It's like life, it seems easy, then gets complicated in a hurry..
Playing with coolant makeup, may give a measurable improvement, for very little spend, changing all the Alloy to copper will give a probable 10%improvement in heat transfer, but comes at huge cost and weight penalty, which would likely negate any power gain made. I suppose what you are trying to do is maximise the main parts you have. As a footnote, adding capacity to a cooling system will only delay the onset of the inevitable problem, if there's a mismatch between the amount of heat generated and the ability of the cooling system to disperse it. If there is a means of speed control on the pump that is linked to flow or return temperature it would be interesting to see if it gets to maximum power, as this would suggest that the heat exchangers should be enlarged. Worth checking your flow and return temps with the system up to normal operating temp to see how much temp drop there is. A cheap infrared temperature gun is a great diagnostic help.
 
When I did Ash Findlers charge cooler + grill intercooler combo, I ran two bosch water circulator pumps in series and 2 Pace ( i think) radiators. You know the ones than run water through the engine after the ignition has been turned off. Ash did say his intake temps were pretty good.
 
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