Starter issue

[sam bignell]

I'm attempting to narrow down a few possible faults with the car.

Two months ago I used the car for a trip down to Cornwall and haven't used her since, three weeks ago I went to start her up to attend an event at castle comb. The car didn't start first time but did on the second, no issues driving and stopped off at a friends to pick him up.

Upon leaving I went to start her up but nothing, the car ticked over but when I tried again nothing. I thought it was a battery issue as it was original so attempted various things but again she didn't start. Finally we bump started her and she roared into life.

I thought best of taking her to castle comb Ferrari day so took the car home. Tucked her in the garage turned it off and she wouldn't start again. Yesterday I bought a Bosch battery and fitted it this afternoon but the new battery hasn't done the job.

So sat in the garden waiting for the AA as I'm a bit miffed shall we say!! Anybody had a similar issue? Hoping they'll diagnose he fault here but coils / starter motor / solenoid issues are running around my head.

Didn't help the AA man who answered the call saying have you put diesel in it . . .

Cheers
Sam

 

[sam bignell]

AA turned up and the cow started first time :evil: , went through the same process and started every time whilst the AA were with me. Drove her home and left her for an hour, took her to meet some friends and started first time outside my house.

After meeting them she wouldn't start again so hand to bump, so back to square one. Starter motor turns first time but second time it's like the battery is dead, although all the electrics work . . . . its a brand new battery! Seems like it won't start when its warm :s

Really pissed off with the car, I'll phone Scott tomorrow but any ideas?

 

[ed_harland]

Starter for sure

 

[k1ano]

Yep sounds like the classic well documented (now anyway) starter degradation symptoms - replace it or risk more inconvenience for sure !

 

[Kett]

Hi Sam,
I'm no expert on automotive electrics - but having resided on this forum for several years... I would say that batteries are prone to failing anytime after 5 years (possibly sooner if not trickle charged) and fuel pumps/starter anytime after 8 years.

I would triple check that the battery is correct spec (as I don't think Bosch make an exact OEM rated product).

This is my first venture into 'older' car ownership and Spike advised me that we will need plenty of patience for foibles. I've been thinking about getting the fuel pump done on mine for this reason - it's ironic that we all happily change the clutch and cambelt every 7 years - as there are plenty of other components that could do with renewal.

Keep the faith Bro! : )

 

[martinr82]

I am also no expert on the Clio's, but I used to get this on my Peugeot 205 GTi.

When it was warm the bugger wouldn't start, wouldn't turn over at all. The cure was.....

Hit the top of the starter solenoid with the base of a hammer handle whilst someone else was turning the key and it worked. I know its not easy on these to do the same thing to basically prove it, but this could well be a cause.

If the Renault is anything like the Peugeot, there isn't a great deal of electrics involved in the starting, so its unlikely to be a gremlin, more likely to be the solenoid sticking when its warm.

Just my 2p

Martin

 

[k1ano]

I am also no expert on the Clio's, but I used to get this on my Peugeot 205 GTi.

When it was warm the bugger wouldn't start, wouldn't turn over at all. The cure was.....

Hit the top of the starter solenoid with the base of a hammer handle whilst someone else was turning the key and it worked. I know its not easy on these to do the same thing to basically prove it, but this could well be a cause.

If the Renault is anything like the Peugeot, there isn't a great deal of electrics involved in the starting, so its unlikely to be a gremlin, more likely to be the solenoid sticking when its warm.

Just my 2p

Martin

I used to have to tap the top of my Mazda 323 starter with a (now get this) turbocharger compressor disk - the company I worked for at the time made them and I had a few cast blanks, it fitted in the palm of my hand superbly and a quick tap on the solenoid would do the trick. My Toyota was the same but I used a socket extension kept in the car. Both of these issues were probably down to heat soak and poor contact surfaces inside, heat alters resistance, but the Vee starter is more difficult to get too ... IMHO tapping the solenoid isnt' really a cure, it's just a 'get out of jail card' really but it can get you out of trouble sometimes, like parking on a slope which I am sure we have all done too ...

It is likely to need replacing as it is common for the heat to cause de-bonding of the internal magnets causing excessive and gradually worsening friction with all the symptoms of poor battery and sticking solenoid - especially noriceable with a hot engine bay or on hot days. If the battery has been replaced, which most of us do (or did do) as step 1 then the starter replacement seems to be the inevitable and growing pattern now ...

Frustration often comes from the helplessness and inconvenience that starting issues can cause, especially away from home ... but the knowledge on this forum should help to ensure that owners know the things to look out for and the remedial action to take to minimise the impact of these things as it really isn't that difficult a thing to ultimately diagnose and fix.

My Vee starting issues caused some embarrasment and inconvenience on a weekend away but fortunately I was with some other Vee owners who had jump leads and plenty of muscle to bump start the car. I ended up buying a new battery (which was needed anyway) and replacing the starter myself (a DIY job for me) and the car turned over magnificently afterwards and with no further issues ...

Martin

 

[sam bignell]

Thanks gents,

I've phoned Scott this morning and I'll be attempting to take her down around four today. I'm really frustrated with the car and realistically I've only used her twice this year, a trip down to Cornwall for the weekend and Preston Hill climb at the Renault stand.

Difficult period with the car at the moment and with my partner moving back home from Cambridge in the coming months I think the score might be on the card to buy our first house . . . . Lets see what Scott says before any drastic statements are made though

 

[Spike]

Sounds about right for starter, read my starter post, it only ever broke down in the worst places, typical. and yes the descision is, buy a house or a starter, the price is about the same for us northeners!

 

[sam bignell]

Thanks spike, Scott sorted me out. Traced the problem to the starter motor and a earthing point issue

 

[martinr82]

Sam

Did Scott say what the earthing point issue was? Loose or just needed a clean up or something else?

Martin

 

[sam bignell]

Unfortunately Scott didn't go into to much detail (I wanted to leave before the rain started) but he cleaned the earthing point replaced a couple of bolts and traced the wires to find no other issues.

Start motor was replaced and the combination of the two resolved my issues. Starter motor is larger from Renault now, the vee turns over differently as a result.